Maps in United States Classrooms

[daan]

Link?

— daan

[Milo]

Link?

Looks like he's talking about http://www.quadibloc.com/maps/mps0408.htm. No anchor, so just search for "CIA".

What was the egregious mistake that was fixed? Since you're snarking about China, I'm guessing it might have something to do with recognition of Taiwan or other disputed territories? ...Yup, I managed to find the original map. It's Taiwan. (In case you're wondering: as a large, economically-powerful nation, the People's Republic of China is valuable enough as a trading partner that most other nations don't want to offend them despite knowing about their human rights abuses. It's all about the money.)

I would also note that a labelled world map isn't necessarily a great way to find the location of something you don't already know at least the approximate location of. That's what alphabetical indices are for.

[daan]

I would not assume that the Wikimedia Commons map has not been edited to suit the preferences of the person who uploaded it.

— daan

[PeteD]

Could it have been intentional? I mean, only 12 countries actually recognize Taiwan as a sovereign country: https://worldpopulationreview.com/count ... ize-taiwan

[Milo]

I would not assume that the Wikimedia Commons map has not been edited to suit the preferences of the person who uploaded it.

Well, I'm struggling to navigate the current CIA website, but I found this on the Wayback Machine: http://web.archive.org/web/20201111232419/https://www.cia.gov/library/publications/the-world-factbook/attachments/docs/original/world-political.pdf. It's 2019 rather than 2015, but it clearly shows Taiwan as a territory of China (note the identical color and the name being in italics and non-uppercased, which according to the legend in the top-left indicates an island rather than a sovereign nation).

Of note is that some other disputed territories are explicitly marked as such (such as the Falklands Islands, which are "administered by U.K., claimed by ARGENTINA", and the southern Kuril Islands which are "administered by RUSSIA, claimed by JAPAN", and even some territory shown as disputed between China and India), but there is no such acknowledgement that Taiwan can possibly be considered anything except a part of China. Well, except for the small-print disclaimer in the bottom right that "Boundary representation is not necessarily authoritative.".

Regardless of this particular map, it's a fact that the Republic of China (Taiwan) is not officially recognized by most UN nations or the UN itself, while the People's Republic of China (China) is.

[daan]

The US position is officially ambiguous, and has been since 1979. The position consists of:

• Acknowledging, but not endorsing, China’s claim to One China.
• Official diplomatic relations with China; unofficial with Taiwan.

Since 1982, the US officially does not acknowledge Chinese sovereignty over Taiwan, but neither recognizes Taiwanese independence.

— daan

[quadibloc]

Since the CIA is an agency of the United States government, it is understandable that despite the disclaimer on the map that the boundaries on it are "not necessarily authoritative", it might be felt that the People's Republic of China would complain that the U.S. was being insincere in abiding by the terms of its recognition of them if the map were accurate in terms of the facts on the ground.
If I want to visit the headquarters of TSMC, I have to get a visa from Taipei; Beijing can't help me.
It used to be that the only maps showing Taiwan as part of China, except for odd exceptions like this, were cheap ones that were printed in China to save money. Now? Even the maps from the National Geographic Society do this!
On the other hand, if you look at a map of Pakistan, you will find that K2 is in the middle of Pakistan, far from the Chinese border. Yet, people climbing K2 have to hand over their cell phones to China just like with Everest - due to a 1965 agreement between Pakistan and China, but the boundary agreed to there isn't even shown on maps. So there is some selectivity in respecting Chinese territorial claims - and in this case, the Chinese territorial claim actually corresponds to the facts on the ground, and should be visible so that the maps are useful in informing travellers what to expect.

[Milo]

The US position is officially ambiguous,

Yes, politicians are great at doubletalk. The US (and most of the world) clearly doesn't like the PRoC much, but still feel the need to appease them and are scared of openly contradicting their claim to Taiwan.

Since 1982, the US officially does not acknowledge Chinese sovereignty over Taiwan,

Apparently not all government departments have gotten this memo, since the CIA was still publishing maps that do in 2019.

Of course, you can't just leave a blank spot on a map. You have to show Taiwan as either independent or not independent, or even disputed, but then you're still showing something rather than going "no comment". (Being disputed territory implies the existence of a state capable of doing the disputing. Actually, that might be the key factor here - people might disagree on whether the Kuril Islands are better off being administered by Russia or Japan, but at least nobody disagrees that both Russia and Japan exist and control some territory that is unambiguously theirs. Then again, North Korea and South Korea are in a similar situation to China where they both claim to be the rightful rulers of all Korea, but most other nations are willing to acknowledge both of them as separate states, presumably because neither of them has the political clout to pressure the international community into doing otherwise.)

in this case, the Chinese territorial claim actually corresponds to the facts on the ground, and should be visible so that the maps are useful in informing travellers what to expect.

I agree that for most purposes, acknowledging de facto territorial control is more useful than respecting alleged borders that exist only on paper. This is why I would make a terrible politician.

[quadibloc]

Incidentally, the CIA map is one of the rare ones that does show the bit China chopped off of Kashmir, so they got that right.

[PeteD]

Yet, people climbing K2 have to hand over their cell phones to China just like with Everest

Climbers have to hand over their cell phones? Really?